tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post7857078303881783090..comments2024-02-12T17:59:33.534-06:00Comments on RAZORED ZEN: December 1Charles Gramlichhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comBlogger43125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-28080713447498748712008-12-08T16:54:00.000-06:002008-12-08T16:54:00.000-06:00Jennifer, actually, that's a very common mispercep...Jennifer, actually, that's a very common misperception. Science "never" focuses on absolute proof. Science provides the closest approximation to truth that can be found at the moment in the natural world, but every scientist is aware that today's facts might be overturned tomorrow. It has not been uncommon in the past for scientists to believe that science was the way to discover God, although that view is less frequent today.<BR/><BR/>Candy, it went by pretty quick, although I was fairly productive.<BR/><BR/>Steve Malley, ;)Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-71066180058568284072008-12-06T02:29:00.000-06:002008-12-06T02:29:00.000-06:00Love that plug! :-)Love that plug! :-)Steve Malleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17561234111786788616noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-44763130848520329302008-12-04T10:43:00.000-06:002008-12-04T10:43:00.000-06:00Is it my imagination, or did this semester go by f...Is it my imagination, or did this semester go by faster than ever? Did I fall asleep and miss a month in there?cs harrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13708705800818667923noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-71562564278226115952008-12-03T13:21:00.000-06:002008-12-03T13:21:00.000-06:00What if I believe God created Science? :)Very int...What if I believe God created Science? :)<BR/><BR/>Very interesting post!<BR/><BR/>I struggle a bit with evolution on a GRAND scale. Evolution on a smaller scale... or adaptation... I can believe in.<BR/><BR/>And I guess the reason that I am not sure that the two can exist in complete harmony is because Science, to me, focuses on PROOF. Neither creation nor Evolution can be PROVEN without a bit of Faith.<BR/><BR/>Again, very interesting post.jhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08547226679311827501noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-33323790112806726492008-12-03T09:17:00.000-06:002008-12-03T09:17:00.000-06:00J. R., I'm holding a moment of silence in your hon...J. R., I'm holding a moment of silence in your honor. Geeze dude! That's horrible.<BR/><BR/>Sidney, I suppose there's something to be said for a target. lol.<BR/><BR/>Rick, your son is wise beyond his years. Take good care of that one. He's the kind of son we could all be proud of.Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-9615715501867989452008-12-03T07:00:00.000-06:002008-12-03T07:00:00.000-06:00So my son reads your posting and says, "Dad, look ...So my son reads your posting and says, "Dad, look at the nice Christmas list this guy made for you. Now you know where to shop." Even I got the hint to buy him a set of your books.Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14546882686381428986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-88996586694652609792008-12-03T06:06:00.000-06:002008-12-03T06:06:00.000-06:00You're right about the waste of energy, but it giv...You're right about the waste of energy, but it gives both sides something to shoot at.Sidneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16284680909152676159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-15001478428423898612008-12-02T23:28:00.000-06:002008-12-02T23:28:00.000-06:00Christmas break? What's that? Would you believe ...Christmas break? What's that? Would you believe I'll be having class the day after Christmas?JR's Thumbprintshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10479324326541901987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-23783878777873138882008-12-02T22:53:00.000-06:002008-12-02T22:53:00.000-06:00Shauna, I agree absolutely.Shauna, I agree absolutely.Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-31303303790553782362008-12-02T17:03:00.000-06:002008-12-02T17:03:00.000-06:00I second your call for civility. Both sides also n...I second your call for civility. Both sides also need some humility. Religious people are willing to rely on scientific evidence instead of the Bible when choosing a treatment for their sick child, and scientists often rely on faith, intuition, and gut instinct when choosing a career path and a research agenda. So the real issue is not reason and logic vs. belief without evidence, but the areas of life in which each is appropriate.Shauna Robertshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03871768714926149114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-14826596172253518022008-12-02T16:25:00.000-06:002008-12-02T16:25:00.000-06:00Pattinase, I think Intelligent Design was carefull...Pattinase, I think Intelligent Design was carefully "designed" to be a political force rather than either a scientific or religious force. I'll have much to say about them in my book.<BR/><BR/>SQT, I'm often amazed at the cognitive twists humans can put their minds through. I know I do it too sometimes, but i'm usually aware of it.<BR/><BR/>Miles, well sure, there's always the important stuff. ;)<BR/><BR/>Aine, I'm beginning to think so. I keep hearing of more books I need to read and I can't postpone the book forever.<BR/><BR/>Anndi, yes, the problem comes in when no "evidence" is considered by a particular person. I more often see the rejection of evidence on the religious side, but that's not always the case.<BR/><BR/>Shauna, I often thing that both sides are making some arguments without enough evidence to back them up. And some patience on either side and some willingness to at least be civil would be a nice start.Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-43894379896107797522008-12-02T15:34:00.000-06:002008-12-02T15:34:00.000-06:00I don't envy you either the job of sorting out the...I don't envy you either the job of sorting out the large number of beliefs in America about the relation of science and religion. Your commenters alone were of several different camps.<BR/><BR/>Myself, I'm all on the science side. Science tells us what was, is, and will be in the physical universe. Religion provides a meaning for it all for those who need one. I don't think either should be butting its nose into the other.Shauna Robertshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03871768714926149114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-51494473743216933722008-12-02T15:14:00.000-06:002008-12-02T15:14:00.000-06:00I too believe they can compliment each other very ...I too believe they can compliment each other very well.<BR/><BR/>I think the danger on the religious stand-point is when everything is interpreted literally. It's also been my experience that the people who do so are extremely difficult to reach.<BR/><BR/>Nicolas Copernicus was a devout man but that didn't stop him from making extremely important discoveries in mathematics and the principles explaining the planets' rotation around the sun.<BR/><BR/>Albert Einstein even believed in a "created universe".<BR/><BR/>I too believe God to be the "first scientist".Anndihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08703154815958841195noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-60769108603239804982008-12-02T14:38:00.000-06:002008-12-02T14:38:00.000-06:00Sounds like an interesting project. I don't envy ...Sounds like an interesting project. I don't envy you the work of reading through all the divergent views, though. There's probably as many variations as there are people in the world...Ainehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08402176500997528105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-62679288215552963122008-12-02T14:13:00.000-06:002008-12-02T14:13:00.000-06:00Interesting, although when we did science at schoo...Interesting, although when we did science at school, it was entirely in the pursuit of mixing A with B to make things blow up...Miles McClaganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10335102965842725449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-28795995828926023362008-12-02T11:58:00.000-06:002008-12-02T11:58:00.000-06:00One thing I thought was so interesting in A.J. Jac...One thing I thought was so interesting in A.J. Jacob's book about following the bible literally was the amount of energy creationists will go to in order to continue with that belief. The mental gymnastics involved is incredible. But I suppose the scientific side is prone to doing the same thing. I can't wait to read what you have to say about the whole argument.SQThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04251030404220909306noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-49223542757002904792008-12-02T10:22:00.000-06:002008-12-02T10:22:00.000-06:00Yes, I always wonder if Intelligent Design is real...Yes, I always wonder if Intelligent Design is really different from Creationism or just an attempt to escape criticism.pattinase (abbott)https://www.blogger.com/profile/02916037185235335846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-43739553677295858142008-12-02T07:59:00.000-06:002008-12-02T07:59:00.000-06:00Eric1313, nothing says he couldn't have.Mary Witzl...Eric1313, nothing says he couldn't have.<BR/><BR/>Mary Witzl, hey, we all have those days. Don't sweat the small stuff. :)Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-44035469428098300522008-12-02T07:57:00.000-06:002008-12-02T07:57:00.000-06:00Good luck fitting in all the things you need to ac...Good luck fitting in all the things you need to accomplish in this busy season :)L.A. Mitchellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11729129827211991040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-59569533466913896392008-12-02T03:18:00.000-06:002008-12-02T03:18:00.000-06:00...um, I meant to say "...what we learn about the ......um, I meant to say "...what we learn about the world through science." Jeesh.Mary Witzlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06458299046574564155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-46638212851455918042008-12-02T03:17:00.001-06:002008-12-02T03:17:00.001-06:00I don't think a belief in God should make us rejec...I don't think a belief in God should make us reject what we learn about the world. It amuses me to hear both scientists and creationists trying to insist that their own beliefs are the only ones that are acceptable. If only they could see how much they have in common. <BR/><BR/>I'm hoping one day I'll be able to teach AND write too! As it is, I'm lucky to be able to write a weekly blog post and make a quick round of my favorite blogs.Mary Witzlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06458299046574564155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-81480871051956946302008-12-02T03:17:00.000-06:002008-12-02T03:17:00.000-06:00I don't think a belief in God should make us rejec...I don't think a belief in God should make us reject what we learn about the world. It amuses me to hear both scientists and creationists trying to insist that their own beliefs are the only ones that are acceptable. If only they could see how much they have in common. <BR/><BR/>I'm hoping one day I'll be able to teach AND write too! As it is, I'm lucky to be able to write a weekly blog post and make a quick round of my favorite blogs.Mary Witzlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06458299046574564155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-44330551150781200382008-12-02T01:34:00.000-06:002008-12-02T01:34:00.000-06:00I wish I had wares to sell on my blog.I need to wo...I wish I had wares to sell on my blog.<BR/><BR/>I need to work harder.<BR/><BR/>As for creationism v/ evolution, why couldn't God have set up the whole chain of dominoes? Makes perfect sense to me too.eric1313https://www.blogger.com/profile/13807078704660045859noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-27504953133551094422008-12-01T23:27:00.000-06:002008-12-01T23:27:00.000-06:00Bernardl, yup.Sarah Hina, I believe part of the pr...Bernardl, yup.<BR/><BR/>Sarah Hina, I believe part of the problem is impatience. Maybe if we just keep learning new things we'll eventually find a natural way to connect them. Forcing them together clearly isn't going to work.<BR/><BR/>David Cranmer, thanks.<BR/><BR/>Ivan, the book I'm reading now, Darwin's God, makes a very similar argument. It's an interesting one but I think it's natural that Darwin's theory had to start out being compared against the earlier creationist view.<BR/><BR/>Steve, I haven't read that one. Thanks for the tip. I'll check it out.<BR/><BR/>Scott, one thing that amazes me about religion is the sheer number of different religions down through the ages, although many of them do have some commonalities. Yeah Krampus.<BR/><BR/>Rick, I agree, and a lot of energy is wasted in attempting that control.Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28221839.post-66592801804187110292008-12-01T22:27:00.000-06:002008-12-01T22:27:00.000-06:00Anna-lys makes the point of God as the first scien...Anna-lys makes the point of God as the first scientist. In Masonry, we think of God as the first craftsman. <BR/><BR/>Religion is, I believe, as ill-served to attempt to control science as science is to try and control religion.<BR/><BR/>Interesting post!Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14546882686381428986noreply@blogger.com